BH for a duo using backing tracks ('case study')

[Ahiru]

I prepared the attached paper for a new BH user describing how our duo (with similar profile/objectives to that new user) uses BandHelper. In case it might be useful to others, I'm posting it here.

This is just one of many ways someone could configure and use BandHelper, so it's intended as a kind of end-user generated 'case study' to stimulate ideas, and not as 'best practices' (though it works very well for us).

It may be most useful for an act that makes full use of backing tracks, and also wants to automate instruments & effects, mixer functions, and lighting.

EDIT 2023-08-27: Corrected errors related to actions / layout actions, and document now updated and re-posted (pointer to changes at the top of the document).

[arlo]

Thanks for sharing!

[JerryK]

So far, I've read pages 1-4.  You're doing just about everything that I/we do and more.  I'm so impressed and will be stealing a few ideas.

My setup is an XR16 for 2 or 3 duo setups and possibly a trio, most members of which come from our 5-piece band, which uses XR18.  These duos were initially triggered by covid restrictions.
So, briefly, various versions of backing tracks mixed from karaoke-version.com which are, Dem (demo everything on the track), DuG (guitar duo), DuK(Keys duo), Kar (for just 1 solo singer) and sometimes Ka2 (for just 2 vocals if the backing needs to be different), and coming along now Tri for the trio, as appropriate.  Those are filename suffixes.
Lighting just runs on its own currently but may be getting an upgrade (thanks) soon.  Perhaps at least speed.
Vocal effects, I've just worked out, thanks to Arlo's hints, will be going OFF at Song Select (and possibly Song End); and ON at Song Second Select (= Start) if it will do all those things.  This should cover those songs where I'm just playing guitar with no backing. I didn't want to make Automation for every song if it's avoidable.  I had planned to send all 4 vocal mics (mostly 2 of 4 people at a time) to an Aux, then that back to a channel (with LR off) to go to FX but gated from the backing channel but that won't work for non-backed songs.  So the start/end midi idea should do it instead.
I already plan to change guitar (Helix) patches from BH but had not thought to have it run more than that.  I'll give that a go too.
I'm not greatly bothered about multitrack recording and the XR16 only does 2-track anyway, so I just press my Rec button on Mixing Station at the start, when I remember - and hopefully Stop at the end or it throws it all away!  Maybe I should automate that too.
I like the Break 'songs' idea.
Already using and muting an ambient mic.
Wired (Behringer P1) or wireless (Gear4Music) IEM.  I switch my source between Aux 5+6 for normal and Main LR to check the house. I must make a button for that instead of menu-fiddling.
Tempo goes to Midi for guitar echo and may soon do lights / mixer.
A BH Custom Text field, across the top, loud and obvious, describes the count-in and intro sequence.  I don't display that on the band's layouts.
Guitar Capo is the one thing I forget most, though it is on the layout. Grr.

Can't wait to read the rest.  Thanks for all the good info.  I must be doing some of it right.

[JerryK]

Ahiru - that's one hell of a list of Midi instructions. 

Chapeau!

[Ahiru]

Vocal effects, I've just worked out, thanks to Arlo's hints, will be going OFF at Song Select (and possibly Song End); and ON at Song Second Select (= Start) if it will do all those things.  This should cover those songs where I'm just playing guitar with no backing. I didn't want to make Automation for every song if it's avoidable.

We also started doing this (vox fx off at Song Select, which is effectively as the previous song ends) and on when the song starts. But now we've evolved to add these commands within the songs' automation, just before the first vocal phrase and just after the last phrase... reason is we sometimes like to talk over the first part of the song or as the song ends, and want that all to be 'flat', no verb, etc.  It's more work, but like a lot of BH tweaks... you'll only need to do it once!  (We still include vox fx off in Song Select for song end, but it's more of a belt and suspenders tactic to make certain there's no fx when talking between songs.

A BH Custom Text field, across the top, loud and obvious, describes the count-in and intro sequence.

Great idea, would be a better place for my guitar PuP settings hieroglyphics!

[JerryK]

Vocal FX - you make a lot of sense.  Drat - haha

Custom field - maybe my Capo field should be large and loud.

[RickP]

I prepared the attached paper for a new BH user describing how our duo (with similar profile/objectives to that new user) uses BandHelper. In case it might be useful to others, I'm posting it here.

This is just one of many ways someone could configure and use BandHelper, so it's intended as a kind of end-user generated 'case study' to stimulate ideas, and not as 'best practices' (though it works very well for us).

It may be most useful for an act that makes full use of backing tracks, and also wants to automate instruments & effects, mixer functions, and lighting.

EDIT 2023-08-27: Corrected errors related to actions / layout actions, and document now updated and re-posted (pointer to changes at the top of the document).

Super helpful for this newbie. Thanks for your time, amigo!

[JerryK]

Ahiru, I don't understand why you use Smart Copies for practice.
I have different versions of Recording on each song, without vocal & guitar for the keyboard duo, without vocal & keyboard for the guitar duo, without all 3 for trio format, with 'everything' for just learning what comes in and how and when.  One or two more as well, so 1 or 2 vocalists can just go karaoke format.  Always in the same order in the BH list.  I just choose the current Default Recording number for whatever format I need at the time.  Hoping that I can one day choose that default on the usual BH screen (or possibly at Layout level) instead of backing out to Settings.
Tracks all come from Karaoke-Version.com and are mixed by me, almost exactly as I choose, though I could probably do with being better at it.

I suspect you have a good or excellent reason that I've not thought of, for using Smart Copies.

[Ahiru]

Ahiru, I don't understand why you use Smart Copies for practice.
I have different versions of Recording on each song, without vocal & guitar for the keyboard duo, without vocal & keyboard for the guitar duo, without all 3 for trio format, with 'everything' for just learning what comes in and how and when.  One or two more as well, so 1 or 2 vocalists can just go karaoke format.  Always in the same order in the BH list.  I just choose the current Default Recording number for whatever format I need at the time.  Hoping that I can one day choose that default on the usual BH screen (or possibly at Layout level) instead of backing out to Settings.
Tracks all come from Karaoke-Version.com and are mixed by me, almost exactly as I choose, though I could probably do with being better at it.

I suspect you have a good or excellent reason that I've not thought of, for using Smart Copies.

In summary, the advantage of Smart Copies is they automatically get any future changes made to the main song to shared data like automation and lyrics, significantly simplifying ongoing maintenance of those fields.

We use Smart Copies for practive versions because a Smart Copy will automatically inherit all automation, lyrics, etc. from the main copy, only changing those aspects of the song you want to override in the Smart Copy.  For our practice version Smart Copies, the only thing we change is the attached recording.  All the automation and lyrics etc. from the main version comes along, but also any future changes made to automation, lyrics etc. in the main copy automatically gets propogated to all Smart Copies.  If we were to just make a new song (e.g. regular Copy), then we'd have to carefully replicate any tweaks to the automation and lyrics in each copy.

[arlo]

I think what JerryK was getting at is why you make smart copies instead of attaching all your recording versions to one copy of a song and switching between them with Settings > General > Defaults > Recording? It seems like that would eliminate the need for the smart copies and the duplicate set lists you're creating.

[JerryK]

I think what JerryK was getting at is why you make smart copies instead of attaching all your recording versions to one copy of a song and switching between them with Settings > General > Defaults > Recording? It seems like that would eliminate the need for the smart copies and the duplicate set lists you're creating.

Just so. Thanks Arlo

I frequently use just 1 song with up to 6 versions of the recording, then choose Default Recording in Settings, depending on which backing format is wanted.

[Ahiru]

I don't use the Default Recordings option because... the idea didn't occur to me LOL!  I agree this is a better way to set up 'practice versions' than Smart Favorites if the only difference is the recording.

[JerryK]

I don't use the Default Recordings option because... the idea didn't occur to me LOL!  I agree this is a better way to set up 'practice versions' than Smart Favorites if the only difference is the recording.

Fair enough.  For me it's not practice versions so much as gig versions, for almost all permutations of guitar, keys, vocal, plus an everything version for learning, and the popular original.
Thanks to your motivation, I've got the basics of song start, second start and song end running for guitar patches and vocal FX on/off.  Next will be the automation for the clever bits.  I think BH won't yet let me scrub through the recording to add the events where I want but I'm hopeful.  That would be easier than MM:SS.mm and always playing from the beginning when setting it up, unless I missed a trick or didn't understand it.

That's not a complaint. It's a damned good app, which I use a lot.

[arlo]

If you add the Automation Controls to a layout, and start the recording from the automation track, then you can use the automation progress bar to move to different points in the song and add events at any point and the recording position will move with the automation position.

[JerryK]

If you add the Automation Controls to a layout, and start the recording from the automation track, then you can use the automation progress bar to move to different points in the song and add events at any point and the recording position will move with the automation position.

You said that before, didn't you?  Sorry, I missed the significance of "Automation Controls", which I've not spotted before.
I'll go to the bottom of the class and try harder