Default Recording # per-Project please?

[JerryK]

Any chance of that, please?
That would be really handy.

[arlo]

Making settings project-specific somehow is on my wish list and I'll add a vote for you.

Speaking more generally, this raises questions about balancing shared versus specific settings across accounts, projects and layouts, so it's as much a conceptual as a technical issue.

[JerryK]

Thanks.
It's slightly helpful that BH plays the highest-numbered recording if there are too few, though I have yet to use that feature in the real world.  I feel I will need to.

[JerryK]

It's getting more complex for me.
Owing to world financial conditions, six-piece band gigs are reducing and duo/trio gigs are on the rise.  Consequently, various band members are now available in various duo/trio combinations, doing mostly the same songs but with different versions of backing tracks.
These usually come from karaoke-version.com and are mixed as required for each line-up.  This is a bit of a nightmare but achievable.
So I'm currently in the process of deploying SIX recordings per song (original, demo for practice and learning the track version, duo with guitar, duo with keyboard, karaoke for solo, karaoke for 2 singers) and perhaps more will follow.  Aarghh!
In order for this to work, the set of recordings has to be identically arranged for every song for any line-up to perform the song, so that the Default Recording number will work for their entire performance.  I have deployed suitable '@Silence' recordings to occupy unused spots in various songs not required by a given line-up.  This will become a problem when 2 duos are out at the same time and happen to update the BH site with the default Recording number; or when someone is practising at home; or other unimaginable scenario.
I realise that different projects and Recording permissions per-line-up could deal with it but that sounds fearfully complex and prone to mistakes.  If someone were to move the 2-vocalist track to the solo vocalist project, or some such scenario, I don't think I could cope.

So can I please upgrade my previous request for different Default Recording numbers per-Project (or even per-user?) to a status of "really Quite Urgent" for my sanity?  I'd suggest per-Event but I don't use them and, anyway, 2 concurrent events might get mind-boggling or worse.

Thanks Arlo.  I'm sure your brain-the-size-of-a-planet can work something out.

[arlo]

Since a few months ago, you can directly edit the project assignments for each recording. So you could have one song shared by many projects, but with different recordings showing in each project. For example, let's say you have three projects:

- Duo
- Trio
- Full Band

Then you have a song with the following recordings, attached in this order:

- Duo backing track
- Trio backing track
- Reference recording

Now you can assign those recordings to different projects:

- Duo backing track: Duo project only
- Trio backing track: Trio project only
- Reference recording: all projects

Then you can view the song in various projects and get these results:

- Duo project: shows Duo backing track in position 1 and reference recording in position 2
- Trio project: shows Trio backing track in position 1 and reference recording in position 2
- Full Band project: shows reference recording in position 1

With this setup, you don't have to change the Default Recording setting, you can just leave it at 1. (But you'd want to use a different layout in the Full Band project that doesn't play the recording automatically if the full band doesn't use backing tracks.) Does that help?

By the way, if you do use the Default Recording setting, that is device-specific and not synced. So one person changing their setting will not create the "unimaginable scenarios" you imagined. :-)

[JerryK]

Oooo-kaaay, thanks for that.
The device-specific Default news is certainly good for me.  Is there a table somewhere of what is stored or shared at which level?  For example, Settings appear to be per-project but I think some are not.

As for the per-Project Recording and User permissions, I'm trying to get my head around it.  What's making that tricky is that the band can also split into various incarnations, with different mixes of members, requiring different Recordings.  I may need to set up a dummy band and splinter groups to work through it!  Haha.
The prospect of assigning all of those permissions, among all of the band's recordings is a bit of a fright.  I may need some time to work out the requirements and method before further observations.  There are currently 300 songs in the band's Project.  Stepping through all of those and getting the permissions correctly set for every Recording against each of - band, guitar duo, keys duo, trio, karaoke1+2 - and also in the right order (I guess that is a constant) is a bit daunting.  I am theoretically not a member of some of those line-ups.  Naming recordings consistently for purpose is a must, which I have done but some added by others will need a tweak.
It seems complex, at this stage.
Is the order of Recordings universal or can that be different per-Project?  No, surely different, I'm over-thinking that part.

[JerryK]

And then I need to both manage it and use it.  So I need all visible to manage but only the current Project's Recordings to perform.  I guess that's two logins?  Can I even do that on a tablet?

[arlo]

No settings are per project. Most are per account+device and some are per user, meaning they sync across a user's devices.

You can't change the order of recordings per project. But that shouldn't be necessary since you can change which recordings appear per project.

You don't need separate logins to manage project assignments, you just need to be assigned to at least one project that contains the item you want to manage. BandHelper won't let you remove an item from all the projects you're assigned to, so every item should be accessible to you through at least one project.

If you're sort of mixing and matching your personnel rather than playing in a few regular configurations, you might simply want to list all the recordings on every song, show the Multiple Recordings button and select the desired recordings on the fly as you perform. But some combination of splitting your recordings into a different projects, and maybe using the Default Recording setting if you have variations within a project, should allow you to automate that.

[JerryK]

Thanks for that Arlo.
So I can list all the "duo" songs (find that in the name) and add/remove projects/users to get it done.
I can manage everything on the web but I will only see what I've allowed myself for the current project+user on the app.

I'll now work out whether that's easier and/or less prone to errors than a single project for all the splinter groups, with all the Recordings or numbered "Silence" clips and a default recording number for the gig.  I think it probably is.
Thanks again for the clarification.

[JerryK]

Remove all users would be handy for me, just possibly all projects too.
Maybe a chance to select multiple to add/remove.

I don’t see a way to match just leading or trailing characters. Any symbols seem to be ignored unless I missed a trick.

[arlo]

You'll see the same files in the website as in the app, but the default file settings aren't available in the website.

Sorry, the search function doesn't have options for matching the start or end of a field, and symbols are ignored.

[Neill00]

It seems like on the root page the projects are listed as accounts but if you go into a song or midi preset, you can choose which of those accounts you want the song or midi preset to show up in under the projects field.  Do I have that right?

So for this issue the solution would be for instance, if you had a duo with two singers/guitar players.  Create your backing tracks from karaoke-version to compliment the singers/guitar players and in the projects field for each song, only allow that recording and no others to show up in the “Duo-singer/guitar player” account/project.  Then it’s the only possible recording that could play if you switch to that account.

I’ve been trying to follow along with this thread as I may have use for this idea but I think I was getting a bit lost so I’m trying to sum it up in my own words.  I suppose the bigger original issue was trying to find a way to accomplish this in some sort of batch command in the instance that you have already attached a bunch of recordings.  But for someone like myself who has yet to make those alternate mixes of the song I could just do it as I go. 

I suppose that since you also want the original song as a reference, for the recording order make it the second recording so that you can have it in every project/account to access if needed but it won’t get played by default when you start the song live.

[arlo]

Accounts and projects aren't the same thing. Accounts contain one or more projects. You can share items across projects, but not across accounts. The root page of the apps shows the account name as a heading with a blue background, followed by a clickable row for each project in that account.

I would place the reference recording last in the order of attached recordings, for the reason you described.

[Neill00]

So on the root page, the “+” in blue beside “Accounts” is to add a “Project”.  In practice, that’s how I have been doing things but I suppose I was just confused on the nomenclature based on the way I read that root page. I suppose the only situation in which I would have to deal with multiple accounts would be if I was in several bands and some of them already had their own accounts.

[arlo]

No, the + button on the Accounts list adds an account. You only have to provide login info at the account level, and then any projects in that account that are assigned to you will appear on that device under that account heading.

"I suppose the only situation in which I would have to deal with multiple accounts would be if I was in several bands and some of them already had their own accounts."

That's correct.

I'll rewrite this with corrections in bold:

"So for this issue the solution would be for instance, if you had a duo with two singers/guitar players.  Create your backing tracks from karaoke-version to compliment the singers/guitar players and in the projects field for each recording, select only the 'Duo-singer/guitar player' project.  Then it’s the only possible recording that could play if you switch to that project."

Assuming you already have your various recording versions attached to a song, you would go to the Repertoire > Songs page, click Edit for that song, then click each recording to open the recording edit popup, then deselect projects as needed in the Projects field so the recording only appears in the projects you want.

When adding new recordings to a song, you would edit that song, then click Add a Recording to open the recording edit popup, then deselect projects as needed in the Projects field so the recording only appears in the projects you want.